Glasgow's Commonwealth Games Bid: 2014

Moderators: John, Sharon, Fossil, Lucky Poet, crusty_bint, Jazza, dazza

Postby Ally Doll » Fri Mar 09, 2007 10:28 pm

Josef wrote:Is there, in existence, a more stultifyingly boring human activity than athletics?


Cricket, golf, and this thread (sorry!)
User avatar
Ally Doll
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 1421
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 1:18 pm
Location: Dennistoun

Postby Fossil » Fri Mar 09, 2007 10:30 pm

Ally Doll wrote:
Josef wrote:Is there, in existence, a more stultifyingly boring human activity than athletics?


Cricket, golf, and this thread (sorry!)


Image

::): ::):
nice one ally

F
Bum tit tit bum tit tit play yer hairy banjo
User avatar
Fossil
-
-
 
Posts: 12311
Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2004 12:07 am
Location: Pitt Street

Postby onyirtodd » Sat Mar 10, 2007 8:55 am

Mori wrote:But why would Glasgow's council want to shoot itself on their foot and promote the bid if they thought they would have to pay for this event for the rest of their days :?:

.......................................................


I don't believe anyone suggests GCC want to do this. It's just how it'll work out. Our beloved leader was asked on television if 'any' commonwealth games had come in on budget he was unable to answer in the affirmative.



Do we really want to have a 21st century Robert Maxwell riding to Glasgow's rescue?
238 to 127. All in all a good afternoon's work
User avatar
onyirtodd
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 3176
Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2006 11:40 pm
Location: a car park near you

Postby Mori » Mon May 14, 2007 11:39 am

Candidate City File can now be downloaded to view.

Very big PDF files btw. :)

Image
User avatar
Mori
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 3434
Joined: Wed May 04, 2005 1:05 pm
Location: Glasgow

Postby MotoMad » Mon May 14, 2007 12:32 pm

I notice your STILL gonna be MILES from the action at hamdump, no surprise there then.

Mon the bid right enough, I think it will be great for the city.
crusty_bint wrote: i.e. they're not a bawhair away from Dickensian!
MotoMad
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 417
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 12:11 pm

Postby escotregen » Thu May 17, 2007 9:05 am

From the city that brought you the revival of 'Angels in America' in the past few weeks... it's Glasgay tae win the Games!


http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/05/16/nigerias_homophobia_makes_glas.html
escotregen
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 1072
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2004 3:35 pm
Location: glasgow

Postby Ally Doll » Thu May 17, 2007 10:39 am

Just looking at those houses - has no one learned that flat roofs don't work in Scotland?! And the wood on the front is not a good look.
User avatar
Ally Doll
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 1421
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 1:18 pm
Location: Dennistoun

Postby Roxburgh » Thu May 17, 2007 6:21 pm

I'm not against bringing sporting events to Glasgow or Scotland.

But really .... who gives a sh!t about the Commonwealth games. We are going to spend a ton of money for an event that is entirely marginal in world sport and which will probably attract fewer paying tourists than the UEFA cup final did.

I seriously question the return on investment for this event.

That money would be far better spent trying to attract a major sporting event like the European Football Championships.

But we bottled out on that one.
Roxburgh
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 529
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 1:54 pm

Postby Alex Glass » Fri May 18, 2007 11:58 pm

With the support of the New First Minister it may now be possible to have both events! ;)
User avatar
Alex Glass
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 2589
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:36 pm
Location: Glasgow

Commonwealth Games funding

Postby crusty_bint » Fri Jun 15, 2007 2:26 pm

taken from Belvidere

Dugald wrote:
AlanM wrote:
Scotland has produced some of the best track cyclists in the world yet they have to go to England to train, why shouldn't we have facilities here?

I agree with you Alan, regarding Scotland producing some great track cyclists, but to a non-cyclist,I'm sure they won't give a second thought to whether Scotland produces great cyclists or not. To build a velodrome will be very expensive, and it will never attract enough spectators to cover operating expenses let alone the cost of building it. (Don't Scottish cyclists currently have the use of the bicycle track in Edinburgh?) The city of Montreal inherited a magnificent velodrome from the 1976 Olympics, but it has done little to improve Canada's standing in world track racing... worth noting too, that montreal is about three times the size of Glsgow, and there are lots of active cyclists there, yet they could never fill the velodrome with spectators. Much and all as I would like to see a good track in Glasgow, I realise it just wouldn't be worth the cost. Spend the money on some good cycle paths instead.


crusty_bint wrote:Dugald, how long have you been in Canada?

The point you and Josef are missing is that the Executive is providing the majority of funding for the velodrome, and its not just a velodrome, its a complex of 2000 seat velodrome, 5000 seat National Indoor Sports Arena and the new HQ of Sport Scotland, Scotlands national sports agency (being relocated from Edinburgh). This combined and integrated facility, coupled with its proximity to a huge football stadium is well placed to act as a regeneration catalyst for the area and your assumption that it will be used once is one borne of naivety.

The velodrome, along with the other facilities I have mentioned will be built regardless of whether or not Glasgow gets the 2014 Commonwealth Games. The reason we are bidding for the games is because these facilities are being built, not the other way round.


AlanM wrote:In addition to Crusty's point, very little of the infrastructure required to host the Commonwealth games is still be constructed, with the majority requiring some upgrading or adaptation for use.
For instance in a city with four 10,000+ seater stadia we are not building a new athletics arena for the games but adapting Hampden to host athletics and therefore not leaving a large building that would get little use after the games, should our bid be successful.


Josef wrote:Fair enough. I freely confess to seldom even finishing the headline of any story that mentions athletics, let alone the story itself, so mentioning the Commonwealth Games was posting from ignorance. Sorry.


onyirtodd wrote:
crusty_bint wrote:Dugald, how long have you been in Canada?

The point you and Josef are missing is that the Executive is providing the majority of funding for the velodrome, .......................... .


Will the Executive be using their own money or, as usual, ours :?:


crusty_bint wrote:It comes from the Block Grant therefore comes out of the national (UK) purse, not from Glasgow Council Tax payers if that's what you're alluding to.


Dugald wrote:" Dugald, how long have you been in Canada? "

Crusty-bint, I can't think of any useful contribution to this discussion that would be provided by an answer to your question, but the reason for it is quite clear, and you have every right of course, to highlight my lack of bone fides : it's been a long time since I paid taxes in Scotland. Although residing in Canada, I found the topic interesting because at one time I was involved in the cycling sport in the West of Scotland and, having had an interest in international sporting events for a long time, I thought my opinion regarding a velodrome and the 2014 Commonwealth Games, might be of interest to some people.

"The point you and Josef are missing is that the Executive is providing the majority of funding for the velodrome, and its not just a velodrome, its a complex of 2000 seat velodrome, 5000 seat National Indoor Sports Arena and the new HQ of Sport Scotland,..."

Yes, I missed this point. Well, I didn't really miss it, I just wasn't aware of it. I don't know what it means anyway. I feel however, regardless of who is said to be providing the funding, that ultimately it will come out of someone's pocket. By coincidence, the city where I live has started construction of an indoor sports arena and the cost has already soared far above the original cost.

"...your assumption that it will be used once is one borne of naivety. "

Oh, I don't think so Crusty-Bint, I think rather, my assumption stems from experience. I've mentioned the 1976 Olympics, and I know of two other velodrome-style tracks in Ontario which quickly fell into disrepair and disuse, and I'd wager they never earned a cent! Over and above this, I recall the very best track cyclists in the world, including the World Sprint Champion, racing at Ibrox Stadium. I was among the few thousand spectators. Any time I raced at Westhorn, I'll bet all the spectators were either cyclists themselves or relatives of competitors. Can you imagine what it would cost Glasgow today to bring a World Champion to their velodrome... I can.

"The reason we are bidding for the games is because these facilities are being built, not the other way round The velodrome, along with the other facilities I have mentioned will be built".

Yes, this is a very important point. I already knew about it and I'm very pleased about it. I think it's great for Scottish cyclists, and I wish them many years of successful competitions. The Sports Centre is also great for Scottish athletes in general. I hope this makes my point of view clear that I am not averse to money being spent for the benefit of Scottish athletes... I'm all for it, but let's not hoodwink the public in order to obtain public money for a small segment of Scottish society.

Anyway Crusty-bint, thank you for your detailed explanation... I'm wiser for having read it. Cheers, Dugald.


crusty_bint wrote:No it wasn't anything to do with taxes, I was curious (and admittedly a tad facetious) as Canada seems to have had a bad experience with hosting the games that has left a bitterness (and, granted, a debt you're still repaying) in your national psyche. However, I don't think Canada's experience is necessarily the inevitable result of hosting the games, Edinburgh has managed it successfully several times and Manchester has done particularly well from hosting a few years back.

In respect to funding, in basic terms the Scottish Executive receives a Block Grant from National (UK) Government which it then decides how it will be spent, allocating budgets to the various National Agencies to spend. So the budget for the velodrome, National Indoor Sports Arena and Sport Scotland HQ has already been allocated and isn't part of the cost of hosting the Games. The additional funding for the Commonwealth Games itself (for the various upgrade schemes and infrastructure works) will come from a different, seperate budget, allocated specifically to the Games. On top of this you have to take into account the wider context of the £1.6billion Clyde Gateway Masterplan in which the legacy of the Games plays a small, but potentially pivotal role.

I appreciate the doubts you have and realise that you're basing your opinion on experience, albeit Canada's experience. Project budgets do overrun, but say what you will about Glasgow City Council, they are particularly shrewd when it comes to large-scale and high-profile projects like this. My experience is that unless a project is financially viable, with a sound business plan and realistic budget and schedule then GCC are very reluctant to invest. And of course someone has to pay for it, you dont get nought for nought in this world, but as I've suggested, the extra investment to hold the games in nominal in comparison to the benefits to the east end and Glasgow, Scotland even as a whole.

And whilst I disagree with you, I am interested to hear your view. What I don't understand however, is that you talk of Glasgow's sporting, specifically cycling heritage in such fond and proud terms yet you have, for want of a better phrase, a pure downer on this. No-ones trying to deceive anyone, everything Iv mentioned is freely available on the web :)

Back the Bid!


Dugald wrote:
crusty_bint wrote:And whilst I disagree with you, I am interested to hear your view. What I don't understand however, is that you talk of Glasgow's sporting, specifically cycling heritage in such fond and proud terms yet you have, for want of a better phrase, a pure downer on this.

Thanks again C.B., for your detailed explanation of the finances; I think I get it now. With regard to my having "a pure downer" about Scotland's "specifically cycling heritage", let me say I don't. Scotland's, and specifically Glasgow's, cycling heritage is rich and well worth remembering. Now, back to the Belvidere. Cheers, Dugald.
Last edited by crusty_bint on Sun Jun 17, 2007 1:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
crusty_bint
-
-
 
Posts: 4425
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 3:52 pm
Location: Glasgow

Postby Bingo Bango » Fri Jun 15, 2007 3:26 pm

Ally Doll wrote:Just looking at those houses - has no one learned that flat roofs don't work in Scotland?! And the wood on the front is not a good look.


Flat roofs can work fine in Scotland if designed, specified and installed correctly.

This is another building element, along with concrete that has suffered after high profile failures in the early years of its use.

many many buildings are now constructed with flat roofs and very few have problems.

I wonder when the first computers came out and were slow and brokedown often what the workd would be like of people had just said 'well, these things just dont work do they?' and left it to other countries or worlds or such to sort out?
Bingo Bango
Second Stripe
Second Stripe
 
Posts: 357
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2005 10:36 am
Location: Glasgow

Postby Socceroo » Fri Jun 15, 2007 3:57 pm

The problem is that Flat Roofs are very rarely designed, specified or installed correctly.

I must have been involved with 30 Projects over the last 20 years with Flat Roofs and i would be struggling to remember which ones never had problems.

It usually goes something like - irate clients and residents pointing at the Contractor who pointed at the Architect who pointed at the Sub Contractor.
User avatar
Socceroo
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 1369
Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2005 8:51 pm
Location: Mount Flo, Glasgow

Postby Alex Glass » Fri Jun 15, 2007 8:06 pm

Socceroo wrote:
It usually goes something like - irate clients and residents pointing at the Contractor who pointed at the Architect who pointed at the Sub Contractor.


And everyone then blames the Council!

Looking arround the City Centre there are a number of building built over the last 100+ year that have flat roofs. I don't claim to be an expert or have much knowledge of the problems suffered because of these buildings having a flat roof. The point I am making is that flat roofs in Glasgow are not a recent type of development following from some disasters from the 70's.

Having just read the last post on the previous page can I thank Crusty, Dugald and Josef for their contribution to the debate about the Commonwealth Games 2014 Bid.

Hopefully Crusty's research has anwered some of the issues people have had about the bid and hopefully go a long way to getting more people to give their support for the bid.
User avatar
Alex Glass
Third Stripe
Third Stripe
 
Posts: 2589
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:36 pm
Location: Glasgow

Postby crusty_bint » Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:51 pm

:)

The Evening Times wrote:Glasgow’s Games bid ‘ticks the right boxes’

THE team studying Glasgow's bid to stage the 2014 Commonwealth Games has awarded the city ticks in all the right boxes, but warned there is still a lot of work to do.

Today the seven members of the Games Evaluation Commission jetted home after four days in the city.

Their tour took in everything from a police training centre, badminton at Scotstoun and the city's major football stadiums, to scaling an East End tower block for an aerial view of the site for a Games Village.

They admitted they were won over by the warm welcome from Glasgow's people who, they felt, were committed, along with the city council and the Scottish Parliament, to making the Games an international success.

Chairman John Tierney described the city's bid as "truly impressive" and heaped praise on the 600-plus page masterplan, the sporting venues and the concept behind the Glasgow bid.

He said the city could provide an ideal backdrop to a successful Commonwealth Games.

Mike Hooper, chief executive of the Commonwealth Games Federation, said the entire city had taken the Games bid to its heart and added: "You should take that as a big tick'. It's very positive."

The bid team still has to clarify a number of technical points raised by the commission after it crammed in 30 hours of presentations on the 16 key themes that will help decide whether Glasgow, or Nigerian capital Abuja, will host the event.

It will then have the job of selling the city to the 70 member countries, who will vote to decide the winner on November 9.

Louise Martin, chairwoman of the Commonwealth Games Council for Scotland, said: "We have to prove to them this is the place where they want to bring their athletes in 2014.

"We want to show them this is the right place to make sure the competitors have the performances of their lives and spectators have the time of their lives."

The first group of visiting countries, the 18 states in Oceania, will arrive for a four-day trip in the middle of next month.

The report on both cities on will be published on September 9.

Mr Tierney said that, win or lose, Glasgow's bid would have a lasting legacy that would "inspire growing international confidence in this wonderful country."

When pressed on the commission's view of Abuja, he said the city was "youthful and offers a significant opportunity." and added: "At some stage they are capable of delivering a Games."

Publication date 14/06/07
here i go, it's coming for me through the trees
crusty_bint
-
-
 
Posts: 4425
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 3:52 pm
Location: Glasgow

Postby My Word » Sun Jun 17, 2007 12:50 am

"The first group of visiting countries, the 18 states in Oceania, will arrive for a four-day trip in the middle of next month."


That'll be Australia, New Zealand and 16 other wee diddy coral outcrops that probably have a combined population of less than the Cowcaddens.
'Hark the Herald Angels Sing'
User avatar
My Word
First Stripe
First Stripe
 
Posts: 78
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 8:52 pm
Location: The Big Whitbread hoose.

PreviousNext

Return to Glasgow Chat (Coffee Lounge)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests