Reds in the Square !

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Postby Dexter St. Clair » Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:08 am

Socceroo wrote:
George Robertson who later became NATO Secretary General. :?


And it worked. NATO is a spent force these days.
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Postby cumbo » Wed Nov 23, 2005 10:29 am

I doubt the comander of NATO forces helping in the India/Pakistan
earth quake zone would see his forces as being spent!
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Postby escotregen » Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:03 am

Socceroo - smashing pieces of real peoples history in these shots. Me and ma pal are standing in the crowd in front of the Post Office. I'll have to get onto the Trust and see if I can examine the originals and spot us both. The visit caused great and genuine excitiment at the time. There was still considerable affection for the USSR in Scotland at the time (only later did reality gradually dawn about the sheer barbarity of that empire with its mass killings that outdid the Nazis).

The Kilmarnock connection with Kosygin was indeed a mixture of it being Secretary Ross's constituency and the Burns connection. Burns was, and I believe still is, hugely poplular in the USSR, now Russia. He was regarded a 'peasant son hero poet' ... mind you the KGB would soon have had him confined to a Gulag and murdered for his views and lifestyle.
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Postby Vladimir » Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:33 am

the KGB would soon have had him confined to a Gulag and murdered for his views and lifestyle.


Too true. Just about anybody who showed any kind of artistic talent outside Stalins choice were locked up. There were the begginings of an architectural and social revolution in Russia,modern art, only to be stamped out by Stalin.
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Postby Socceroo » Wed Nov 23, 2005 1:55 pm

The real interest for me with those Pics, apart from my interest in Scottish - Russian relations, is that the Photos were taken days before i was born.

So for me it is a fascinating insight to what Glasgow was like at that time.
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Postby escotregen » Wed Nov 23, 2005 4:22 pm

Speaking from experience it was pretty appalling with just about everything going wrong for the city. Certainly me and my pal in the photograph were already making our future plans to escape to London as soon as we finished school.

The 'big shemes' were mostly almost built and their severe problems of alienation and gang violence were growing - mind you the good old Cooncil never was for learning, and it was another decade later when they were still building another intended big scheme in Darnley. The distress and growing collapse of the traditional stalwart industries was gathering speed. The consequent unemployment added to the problems in the big schemes.

Meantime, the older areas of 'clearance and demolition' lay empty; much of it cleared for the new god of cars and motorway systems (in a city with one of the lowest car-ownership rates in the UK - still true). The joke at the time was 'with all these new motorways you'll be able to get right through Glasgow in nae time, don't even need to stop there'.

The popular culture of cinema-going and the communities of the older areas were fast collapsing. For thinking Glaswegians there was the ever present but repressed fear that 'The Bomb' might go off off at any time... the Cuban crisis had been only a few years before. We were aware that with the Yanks at Faslane, Glasgow was a primary target in any nuclear conflagration.

The old tenemental stock was mostly filthy soot black and none were cleaned or rehabed. Emigration rates were reaching towards an all-time high; the new towns were sucking out much of the skilled working class and upwardly mobile middle class (part of the now-disclosed 'secret' Scottish Office policy of down-scaling Glasgow.

I honestly find difficulty in recalling much positive in that time apart from some of the magnificant new ships making their way down the Clyde and the best Christmas street lights ever... and the fact that I was growing up in it :) I was well glad to get out of it.

But my point in detailing this dreary litany is to stress just how incredibly well Glasgow has done in having gone down even more than I described it then opulled itself so far back up to what it is today - brilliant achievement Glasgae peeple!
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Postby viceroy » Wed Nov 23, 2005 6:16 pm

escotregen wrote:But my point in detailing this dreary litany is to stress just how incredibly well Glasgow has done in having gone down even more than I described it then opulled itself so far back up to what it is today - brilliant achievement Glasgae peeple!


Couldn't agree more. There are still many, many problems in this city and I would be the first to acknowledge these. But when I think back on what a dump Glasgow was during the sixties and early seventies and the complete loss of pride in the place at that time, I realise the extent to which things have improved.
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Postby Vladimir » Wed Nov 23, 2005 6:47 pm

I would be the first to acknowledge these.


Im not sure about that :wink:
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Reds in the Square !

Postby Socceroo » Fri Nov 25, 2005 1:37 am

Some more Pics from the Scotland - Russia Trust
archive of Kosygin's visit to Glasgow in February 1967....

Image

Kosygin arrives in Railway Station (Glasgow Central?).

Image


Talking to Railway Staff and the public in the Railway Station.

Image

The above pic is a bit fuzzy with Kosygin bottom centre of Photo.

The Photo also shows quite well the old TB Clinic, which
later became Travel Centre and Tourist Information
post in George Square.

Image

Again an old colour pic taken by a member of the then
Scotland - USSR Society. Photo shows Kosygin amongst
the crowds in George Square.

Also the Photo is taken in the general direction of
where Escotregen was viewing proceedings!

Note also bus in background for Glasgowken.

Image

Above Photo also a bit fuzzy, with the KGB bodyguard in
better focus than Kosygin, but one of my favourites.

Kosygin was known as the great survivor, due to his ability
to survive the Stalinist purges of the inter war and post war
years due to his recognised administrative skills.

It is said that he was so dedicated to his job that he did not
leave his desk later that year (1967), when he heard that his
wife was dying.

For someone supposed to be stone faced according to Richard Nixon,
he seems to be enjoying the Glasgow crowds.

Image

At entrance to City Chambers meeting various City officials.
I do not know who these officials were. Might be the various
Lord Provosts of different cities in Scotland or Deacon Convenors
of Trades Hall, Chamber of Commerce etc?

Image

Close up Photo of Kosygin entering City Chambers.
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Re: Reds in the Square !

Postby glasgowken » Fri Nov 25, 2005 1:56 am

Socceroo wrote:
Note also bus in background for Glasgowken.




Much appreciated :D
Great photos btw, even the ones without buses :wink:
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Postby escotregen » Fri Nov 25, 2005 10:54 am

Yes more great stuff! I can add a wee bit more hsitory to confirm how Kosygin enjoyed himself.

A day or so later he was down at London airport being seen off by Premier Harold Wilson, (another one of those Labour visionary leaders who somehow didn't deliver). At the end of the stilted diplomatic farewell utterances Kosygin personally interjected through his interpreter to "and of course" say how much he appreciated the wonderful reception from the "Glasgow and Scottish people".

Wilson and the British entourage looked quite discomfited and bemused as they probably had little idea of what he was on about... the national British media had of course entirely ignored the rapturous reception he had received in Glasgow.

This reminded me of the same treatment that our First Minister Jack McConnel got when he was the politician to personally greet and accompany the Chinese President when he arrived on his recent state visit to the UK. This followed Jack's McConnel's own reasonably succesfull visit to China just previously. The British national media (and I think maybe even our own wee regional media?) totally ignored Jack's undoubted diplomatic point-scoring on the global stage in being the one to greet the Chinese President... how little things have changed?

On another aspect of the photgraphs, isn't striking has macho the whole Glasgow scene was? Wimmin kept in their places, mainly being the dainty wife following... although I notice one cheeky young rascal peeking above at the back of the crowd in front of the TB unit in George square.... we never did manage to ever really fully keep them in their place :D
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Postby escotregen » Mon Nov 28, 2005 9:15 am

Socceroo, on the exciting development plans you have with the Scotland - Russia Trust. As a WW2 buff I wondered if have you established any links with the WW2 Russian Convoy Association people. I would imagine that they would have a lot in common with the Trust and maybe even some useful material to share. You may have recently seen media coverage of some of the convoy veterans in Scotland being presented with medals by Rusian Government officials
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Postby Socceroo » Mon Nov 28, 2005 7:09 pm

Escotregen, i believe the Scotland - USSR Society as it was previously, was heavily involved with the Baltic Convoy veterans who manned Merchant Ships and Royal Navy Escorts up to Archangel and Murmansk.

I know that quite a few of them were members for many years.

There is a whole file of Photo's - with a lot of the veterans in the 1980's and early 1990's receiving their medals in Belmont Crescent from the Soviet Consul General and Soviet Admirals etc.

I think the most recent big event was at the 50th Anniversary of the conclusion of WWII with various ceremonies in Russia.

I'll maybe stick a Photo or two on this thread. It is certainly something that will be covered on the Scotland - Russia Trust website.
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Postby Schiehallion » Mon Nov 28, 2005 10:53 pm

Have you seen this photo from the St Andrew's Halls (1949) before Socceroo?

Image
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Postby Vladimir » Mon Nov 28, 2005 11:51 pm

WOW 8O
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