Buses Today

[Josef]

The Bastards will have to prize my concession ticket from my cold dead hands. Worked all my fuckin life for mine while fuckin junkies, drop outs asylum seekers and allsorts get them. Bring it on mother......

As I recall, you're of the generation that enjoyed free school milk, free University education (and relatively generous grants), council housing according to need (..etc), and then voted to abandon all of those when it came your time to pay the bill for future generations. That voted to take mutual organisations and throw them to the wolves of the 'market' for a quick short-term buck. That....

I'd withdraw the free bus pass and make yeze pay double. And then reinstate it in twenty years time when you're all dead.

Nyaah ha ha.

[rabmania]

The Bastards will have to prize my concession ticket from my cold dead hands. Worked all my fuckin life for mine while fuckin junkies, drop outs asylum seekers and allsorts get them. Bring it on mother......

As I recall, you're of the generation that enjoyed free school milk, free University education (and relatively generous grants), council housing according to need (..etc), and then voted to abandon all of those when it came your time to pay the bill for future generations. That voted to take mutual organisations and throw them to the wolves of the 'market' for a quick short-term buck. That....

I'd withdraw the free bus pass and make yeze pay double. And then reinstate it in twenty years time when you're all dead.

Nyaah ha ha.

Hear, hear.

[Dexter St. Clair]

drop outs asylum seekers and allsorts get them. Bring it on mother......

Do the allsorts include retards, cripples, their Lous and toffs over the age of sixty regardless of their income? Are you mixing your asylum seekers up with your A8 and A2 nationals? Or maybe registered FE students holding transcards?

[busdriver]

The catagories of entitlement for the Scotland wide Concessionary Travel Scheme, (National Entitlement Card ) are as shown below in each and every case you must show proof of entitlement when applying, the cards are not issued automaticly.

Older People:
If you are over 60 years of age and live in Scotland.

Disabled People:
Eligible disabled people of fare paying age (aged 5 and over) who meet the criteria also qualify for a National Entitlement Card to access Scotland -Wide Free Bus Travel. the categories which may apply are:

Receive the higher rate of the mobility component of Disability Living Allowance
Receive the higher/middle rate of the care component of Disability Living Allowance
Receive Attendance Allowance
Live in a care or residential home or hospital and require 24 hour supervision
Hold a Disabled Persons Parking Badge (Blue Badge)
Are profoundly or severely deaf
Have been told not to drive on medical grounds
Suffer from a mental illness, learning disability or personality disorder
Are terminally ill
Suffer from a progressively degenerative disorder
Have suffered a loss of limbs
Are visually impaired

Whether someone has "worked all their life", is a"Junkie", "Asylum Seeker" or a "drop out" are not elegible criteria and would not qualify under current legislation governing the scheme.

As for being asked to "state your destination" when using your card, even fare paying passengers are required to to do this under the terms and conditions of carriage, of almost every provider of public transport, and has always been the case. A fact overlooked by the vast majority of the travelling public until the driver demands to know. In this particular case, because concessionary travel costs are paid for by the taxpayer from public funds, the schemes governing body "Transport Scotland" have to provide statistical information showing that we are getting value for our money and this is done by showing the number and type of journies undertaken this information is gathered at point of delivery when inputted to the ticket machine by the driver.

The scheme is vastly underfunded and in its first year of operation (1st April 2006/2007) the scheme ran out of money and had to be bailed out by additional funding from UK government. The bus companies and other operators receive only a proportional reimbursement of the cost of each concession journey something like 75% of the total and have always complained of running at a loss. Now that the electronic ticket system has been fully implemented it should be possible to monitor costs more closely and ensure that operators get their fair share of concessions.

[Josef]

Thanks, busdriver. Excellent reply.

Just to clarify, though, when you say "The bus companies and other operators receive only a proportional reimbursement of the cost of each concession journey something like 75% of the total and have always complained of running at a loss.", do you mean of the cost to the operator or of the stated fare for the journey?

[BrigitDoon]

The Bastards will have to prize my concession ticket from my cold dead hands. Worked all my fuckin life for mine while fuckin junkies, drop outs asylum seekers and allsorts get them. Bring it on mother......

As I recall, you're of the generation that enjoyed free school milk, free University education (and relatively generous grants), council housing according to need (..etc), and then voted to abandon all of those when it came your time to pay the bill for future generations. That voted to take mutual organisations and throw them to the wolves of the 'market' for a quick short-term buck. That....

I'd withdraw the free bus pass and make yeze pay double. And then reinstate it in twenty years time when you're all dead.

Nyaah ha ha.

Right, which of ye's payin' fer me new keyboard?

[The Egg Man]

................
As for being asked to "state your destination" when using your card, even fare paying passengers are required to to do this under the terms and conditions of carriage, of almost every provider of public transport, and has always been the case. A fact overlooked by the vast majority of the travelling public until the driver demands to know. In this particular case, because concessionary travel costs are paid for by the taxpayer from public funds, the schemes governing body "Transport Scotland" have to provide statistical information showing that we are getting value for our money and this is done by showing the number and type of journies undertaken this information is gathered at point of delivery when inputted to the ticket machine by the driver.

The scheme is vastly underfunded and in its first year of operation (1st April 2006/2007) the scheme ran out of money and had to be bailed out by additional funding from UK government. The bus companies and other operators receive only a proportional reimbursement of the cost of each concession journey something like 75% of the total and have always complained of running at a loss. Now that the electronic ticket system has been fully implemented it should be possible to monitor costs more closely and ensure that operators get their fair share of concessions.

Thanks for that reply. It had occured to me that it might have something to do with more accurately monitoring usage and recouping revenue.

A couple of points occur. The signs have only recently appeared. Has that something to do with the electronic ticketing you mention?

A lot of people don't actually bother to state their destination and the drivers don't ask. How does the bus company get reimbursed at the correct rate on a 9 from Partick to the city centre as opposed to from Partick to Linwood and anyway isn't the cost of the journey pretty much the same with or without passengers?

[busdriver]

Thanks, busdriver. Excellent reply.

Just to clarify, though, when you say "The bus companies and other operators receive only a proportional reimbursement of the cost of each concession journey something like 75% of the total and have always complained of running at a loss.", do you mean of the cost to the operator or of the stated fare for the journey?

This is where it gets a little more complex
Bus operators are entitled to fair reimbursement for carrying concessionary travellers. This covers both fare revenue foregone and any additional costs that may result. Operators are reimbursed at 75% of the cost of a ticket for each journey.

Reimbursement is made on a "no better, no worse off basis," so operators should neither gain nor lose money as a result of carrying concessionary travellers. However due to rising costs operators continue to complain that they suffer losses from participation in the scheme.

Their are reforms being discussed that will see the rate at which bus operators can claim reimbursement for free travel reduced from its current level to something like 67%. Already the scheme has been capped at £174.2m in the next financial year, rising to £187m in 2012/13.

[The Egg Man]

Does the "no better, no worse" take into account journeys which wouldn't happen were it not for concessionary tickets? People who forgo taking the car with all the associated fuel and parking costs and use the free bus instead.

[peter]

Looks like I still have the abiity to wind things up. I am in fact not yet old enough far a bus pas. However I have an adut son who has a concession pass. So I wonder what the reaction would have been if I said that in the first place.
I dont see why pensioners shouldnt have their pass. Most have no other means of travel. Also how many of you who reacted actually travel on a bus. Not many I think. Most bus users are poor students, many lowlifers ie NEDS, OAPs, and a lot of asylumseekes not yet able to own cars. Recently returning from Edinburgh we had a frightening experience on a 66 heading west as it passed by Kingsway with loads os neds wanting to do battle on the bus.
For those who have gotten used to free bus pass after ae of sixty I say good luck cause the Torys will sure a hell take it away. Oh and for the younger ones who sneer i say dont be so keen to slag off the oldies case who's gonna pay for your pension onyears to come. Anyway am off to put Yankee flag up and **** the English.

[busdriver]

The Egg Man Wrote:
Thanks for that reply. It had occured to me that it might have something to do with more accurately monitoring usage and recouping revenue.
A couple of points occur. The signs have only recently appeared. Has that something to do with the electronic ticketing you mention?
A lot of people don't actually bother to state their destination and the drivers don't ask. How does the bus company get reimbursed at the correct rate on a 9 from Partick to the city centre as opposed to from Partick to Linwood and anyway isn't the cost of the journey pretty much the same with or without passengers?

Indeed, now the system has been fully integrated and tested it was felt this would be an appropriate time to bring in the signs although Arriva did introduce them a few months earlier.

Drivers dont ask simply because most regular (fare paying) passengers have themselves asked and been told the cost the cost of a ticket for their journey and generally pay the correct fare, only when they are unsure or unfamiliar with the route do they tell they driver. Granted drivers should ask but tend to seek a simpler life. We may well see a change in this attitude in coming months.

Journey costs are calculated according a mathematical formulea which I dont even begin to understand. Simply put though, this takes into account the mileage costs for a journey such as fuel useage, wear and tear, lost mileage, etc,, and other costs which then produces a mitigated scale of charges (fares) paid by the passenger to meet the cost of each journey without these costs being prohibitve. The fare chart the driver uses is an example of these mitigated fares, broken down into a series of incremental fare stages along the route and is designed to offset the costs of the journey without passengers being charged what would be staggeringly high prices.

I hope this helps.

[The Egg Man]

Thanks.

[derekgoodman]

The reimbursment to operators was recently cut to something like 63%

[Bridie]

Which buses are better to board in order to escape the lower classes and their sort?
The Nos 10 and 10a used to be fairly classy as they ambled their way round the leafy west end.
Also what's the criteria now for an errant schoolchild who's spent their bus money at the sweety shop yet still required to board the bus to get home?

[busdriver]

Which buses are better to board in order to escape the lower classes and their sort?

Also what's the criteria now for an errant schoolchild who's spent their bus money at the sweety shop yet still required to board the bus to get home?

I would suggest Private Hire, if you wish to avoid the "lower classes and their sort" completely. The smaller operator may be another option as these are not so frequent and so not often used by the more obvious "lower classes".

Children (between the ages 5 and 16 years) like adults are still required to pay for their journey. The policy in First, is that if the unacompanied child is unable to pay they should not be refused travel, but should be asked for their name and address so their parents are billed. Idealy they would be asked for proof of address. If however the driver forms the opinion that the child travelling alone is "at risk" then the Police should be involved.